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hatching / screen tone brush set?

 I wanted to play around with some classic black and white manga style artwork today, and after quite a long time searching through TwistedBrush I can't seem to find any fitting hatching or screen tone brushes.


Examples of manga screen tone:

image

image

image



Hi Von Toma,


Interesting, I can see the value in this. Perhaps this could be handled with a pattern brush. However that would limit layering I will make note of this and perhaps it's something that could be added.


Ken

A new ArtSet has (Art Pro - Screen Toning) been added to the just released TwistedBrush Pro Studio 23.03.


http://support.pixarra.com/discussions/topics/22000005892


It might be different than what you are looking for since these are implemented as brushes and not filters or fill patterns.


Ken

 They are quite interesting, I look forward to experimenting with them. :D


Along with experimenting with the brush code as well as they give a good starting point.


Here are two brushes I made tonight modifying the dot 1 brush slightly.

Square Dot Tone:

image


 

** START BRUSH CODE
2303
0,0,0,9,6,40
Basic
Smooth no feather
3,254,41,254,255,107,255,190,95,0,0,0,0
Cor Dab Soft,combo,9,9
Cor Dabit Alpha,combo,1,0
Set Var 1[1]Grid Size[2]4[3]25[4]0[5] [6],combo,0,4
Bristles Uniform,getvar1,0,7
Size Abs[1]Tone Size[2]0[3]19[4]0[5] [6],combo,0,3
VM Percentage,combo,9,5
Snap x,getvar1,0,7
VM Percentage,combo,9,5
Snap y,getvar1,0,7
Lay Smooth2,combo,7,0
bShape,combo,0,8
No effect,flat,0,3
No effect,combo,0,0
No effect,flat,0,0
No effect,combo,0,0
No effect,flat,0,0
No effect,combo,0,0
No effect,combo,0,0
No effect,combo,0,0
No effect,combo,0,0
No effect,combo,0,0
No effect,combo,0,0
No effect,combo,0,0
No effect,combo,0,0
No effect,combo,0,0
No effect,combo,0,0
No effect,combo,0,0
No effect,combo,0,0
Square Dot Tone
0,1,0,0,1,1,1,1,241,270,408,270
brush
** END BRUSH CODE

 Vertical Line Tone: (I like your vertical line tone it is very unique this one is just a little more standard/classic looking)

image


 

** START BRUSH CODE
2303
255,255,255,9,100,40
Basic
Smooth no feather
3,254,41,254,255,107,255,190,95,0,255,255,255
Cor Dab Soft,combo,9,9
Cor Dabit Alpha,combo,1,0
Set Var 1[1]Grid Size[2]4[3]25[4]0[5] [6],combo,0,5
Bristles Uniform,getvar1,0,7
Size Abs[1]Tone Size[2]10[3]40[4]0[5] [6],combo,1,0
VM Percentage,combo,9,5
Snap x,getvar1,0,7
VM Percentage,combo,0,5
Snap y,getvar1,0,7
Lay Smooth2,combo,7,0
bShape,combo,1,2
No effect,flat,0,3
No effect,combo,0,0
No effect,flat,0,0
No effect,combo,0,0
No effect,flat,0,0
No effect,combo,0,0
No effect,combo,0,0
No effect,combo,0,0
No effect,combo,0,0
No effect,combo,0,0
No effect,combo,0,0
No effect,combo,0,0
No effect,combo,0,0
No effect,combo,0,0
No effect,combo,0,0
No effect,combo,0,0
No effect,combo,0,0
Vertical Line Tone
0,0,0,0,1,1,1,1,241,270,408,270
brush
** END BRUSH CODE

 


 I've been enjoying myself making some brushs, I'm thinking once I get some details worked out I could make a larger set and submit it.


At the moment I'm having issues with fill brush to work. It is very much fun to paint tone, but I think it would be nice to add a full set of standard fills as well. The issue I'm running into is that rotation in the brush effects doesn't seem to produce very good quality results.


image


 

** START BRUSH CODE
2303
0,0,0,70,100,20
Covers
Plain coverage
3,255,255,255,198,198,198,190,95,0,0,0,0
bShape,combo,5,7
Grid[1]Grid Size[2]20[3]80[4]0[5] [6],combo,5,0
Rotate[1]Tone Direction[2]0[3]100[4]0[5] [6],combo,0,0
No effect,combo,0,0
No effect,combo,0,0
No effect,combo,0,0
No effect,combo,0,0
No effect,combo,0,0
No effect,flat,0,0
No effect,flat,0,0
No effect,flat,0,0
No effect,flat,0,0
No effect,combo,0,0
No effect,combo,0,0
No effect,combo,0,0
No effect,combo,0,0
No effect,combo,0,0
No effect,combo,0,0
No effect,combo,0,0
No effect,combo,0,0
No effect,combo,0,0
No effect,combo,0,0
No effect,combo,0,0
No effect,combo,0,0
No effect,combo,0,0
No effect,combo,0,0
No effect,combo,0,0
No effect,combo,0,0
Heart Tone Fill
0,0,0,0,1,1,1,1,241,271,240,89
default
** END BRUSH CODE

 

You are making really good progress on brushes!! Looking forward to seeing the ArtSet when you submit it.


The rotation as show in (2) a brush effect is a low quality rotation for performance reasons (must be done for each dab of paint). Is this screen shot below you can see if I use the higher level brush rotation (1) which is just done once and the results are much nicer (zoomed in)


image


Ken

Yes that dose provide much better results.

This may sound like a strange request, but do you think it would be possible to add a "brush effect" that was a UI button that would pop up a window of text?

My thoughts are that having to use the brush rotation is not going to be obvious for new users, therefore it would be nice to give some detailed help and tips in a place where it would be noticeable and easy to find.

A quick mocked up example:

image




 

It's an interesting idea. It might present some challenges in the actual brush codes since the text would need to be stored with the brushes and exportable to text brush codes. 


Have you considered if the ArtSet description area would work for presenting this kind of information rather than embedding it in each brush. 


One point about the rotation. Clips and clip brushes actually use the high quality dynamic rotation. Somehow I thought there was a way to get shapes to also use high quality rotation when using the "Shape Brush" brush effect. However, I am not seeing this high quality rotation with Shape Brushes. I will have to explore why that isn't working as I would have expected.


Ken

 The ArtSet description area would probably work, it would reduce redundancy to a degree, though it could reduce relevancy as well unless brushes where broke up into relevant artsets. Of course that may very well be over thinking things. After all I am having fun, though I do not know if I will ever be making enough brushes to make it truly worth wild. XD Of course I have decide that TwistedBrush is my favorite painting program and I do very much want to do some meaningful contributions.


On the artset description a change would still be needed though as it is now you can only have a single line of text. The line seems to be able to be very long, however it leaves no ability to do formatting of any real sort for readability.


Just some thoughts to avoid brush code conflicts perhaps it could be added as an if statement at the bottom of the code:


** START BRUSH CODE

[Brush code here]

** END BRUSH CODE

** START BRUSH TEXT

** END BRUSH TEXT



So I'd imagine the code would be something like: if ** START BRUSH TEXT section exists the button is automatically added to the UI of the brush control panel.


That way it could be something that is simply manually added to the bottom of a brush code, as needed. As for exports it may actually be best to not include the text. As I'd wager that as the brushes are being used as part of an artset the only time you would be exporting the code is either because it was modified which means the text may no longer be relevant and should be removed, or for trouble shooting at which point it's simply junk at the end making longer posts here. If someone really wanted to share a brush it would be more prudent of them to share the whole artset files if they wanted all the extra info.

All and all just some thoughts.

Thinking about it more in a lot of ways it would truly be nice to have something robust enough that you could even embed small images. As in essence what could be an interesting feature would be to add mini tutorials into TwistedBrush so that over time it could really add to it's value as not just being a tool to paint, but a tool to help you learn as well.


For example the basic mesh tone brush I've come up with can be used to make a lot of fun tone effects, and be a versatile tool if you know how to use its settings along with the proper layering techniques. However someone new would not, and if left entirely on their own may take a long time to learn such techniques if ever, and if they are forced to venture out to the web to search for everything they are much more likely to find how to do it in a more common program such as Photoshop, which would do them little in TwistedBrush.


I suppose I'm thinking about it a lot now, as when I first started using TwistedBrush years ago I recall having no idea how to properly use many of it's brushes.

 


image


 

** START BRUSH CODE
2303
0,0,0,9,49,70
Covers
Plain coverage
3,254,30,254,123,0,255,138,138,138,0,0,0
bShape,bnk4,0,6
Cor Dab Soft,combo,9,9
Cor Dabit Alpha,combo,1,0
Set Var 1[1]Grid Size[2]10[3]29[4]0[5] [6],combo,1,8
Bristles Uniform,combo,3,0
Size Abs,combo,2,5
Snap x,getvar1,0,7
Snap y,getvar1,0,7
Lay Smooth2[1]Solid Tone[2]0[3]1[4]1[5] [6],combo,7,0
No effect,combo,0,0
No effect,combo,0,0
No effect,combo,0,0
No effect,combo,0,0
No effect,flat,0,0
No effect,combo,0,0
No effect,flat,0,0
No effect,combo,0,0
No effect,combo,0,0
No effect,combo,0,0
No effect,combo,0,0
No effect,combo,0,0
No effect,combo,0,0
No effect,combo,0,0
No effect,combo,0,0
No effect,combo,0,0
No effect,combo,0,0
No effect,combo,0,0
No effect,combo,0,0
Square Mesh Tone
0,0,0,0,1,1,1,1,241,271,240,89
brush
** END BRUSH CODE

 

You are building quite a nice collection of brushes! Also thanks for your added feedback about integrated information about brushes/ArtSets. No conclusion from my side on a direction only because the it's possible to add some information for the ArtSet. But your point is well taken that it's an unformatted line of text.


Thanks,

Ken

The next release will include a new brush effect "Reload Shape". This will allow for high quality rotation of shape brushes (at at the cost of performance.



image

1. Without Reload Shape (before)

2. With Reload Shape (after)

3. Small brush size to show difference

4. Zoomed in to show difference

5. The new brush effect.


Ken



 That is quite exciting! I look forward to incorporating it into the artset!

On a semi-related topic I've been trying to figure out how to get the best possible brush shape quality.
It seems the built in brush shapes use .png at 150x150 or 300x300 and a format I am unfamiliar with ".isf"


So I was wondering on two paths:

Is their a way that a vector format such as .SVG or something similar could be used (Or is that what the isf file type is already?) so that the brush shape is regenerated for every size.


or


Is there any brush effect way you could think of that would allow the bshape to change based on the size of the brush so I could make 3-4 optimized .png each for a different size range.

Pretty much a way to define an outcome based on the percentage. If brush size is .25 or below then use bshape bnk19 0 1 if it's .26-.50 use bnk19 0 2 if it's .51-.74 use bnk19 0 3 if it's .75 or above use bnk19 0 4.



The isf format is a procedural generation format that TwistedBrush can make use of. It is an SDK that is part of a product called Image Style by Paurex. However, it is possible Paurex is no longer in business.


Currently no vector formats are used for brush shapes however the isf format allows for a good deal of some of the same benefit.


The use of larger size shape files as PNG should be sufficient. Without dynamic rotation or sizing the brush shapes are resized with high quality algorithms much as you would do if you created multiple versions are you proposed. The Reload Shape brush effect should give the same benefit at a cost of dynamic performance. However it is expected for specific needs not general purpose painting.


Ken

I most admit upon reading this my first instinct was to reply with what my teachers had told me.

Instead much testing ensued.


I am very impressed TwistedBrush dose seem to sample down all it's brushes to near equal quality that I could export a vector. so a 300px brush can turn into a 50px just as well as a native 50px vector export.

However it dose not upscale to the same quality a 150px brush is noticeably much worse than a native 600px brush. As B&W manga is commonly printed at 600 & 1200 ppi on A4 and B4 page sizes.

As it would seem the current 32-bit limitation of TwistedBrush Prevents working in 1200ppi thereby 600ppi is the limit I have concluded that simply making brushes at 300px seems to be all that is needed at the time. However if there were plans to move TwistedBrush to 64-bit support then I'd be best making brushes at 600px



Thank you for the information about .isf I have contacted Paurex and they have indeed gone out of business. However they were kind enough to give me a copy to use. 

As far as my testing showed it did not seem to provide any better quality in the brush engine compared to the .png files. I assume the reason for this is the .isf files exported by Image Styles are a set size 150px 300px 600px ...etc and in thus provide the same quality as their counterparts in .png.




150px brush upscale to 600px on the left, native 600px brush on the right.

image




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